Dear Stephanie emailed me to question one of my nursing tips, #4.
She's concerned that you won't get the best milk for your baby if you follow my tip, but I think she misunderstood what I was saying, which means that others might have too, so let me clarify.
I'm a big advocate of just relaxing and letting the baby nurse until he falls asleep. I hope that is what you've been getting from these posts.
Of course, as the experts point out (and I'm not an expert, but I do know about this), the “hind milk,” or milk that the baby is getting when the breast seems empty to you, contains the marvelously nutritious fats he needs for good health.
On top of that, it's just a joy to experience your baby's contentment, feel his total relaxation, and also be off your feet yourself.
Nick with Papa, about one month old. |
{If you bottle feed, you need to figure out how to get this aspect of life with baby into your routine.}
Taking care of a baby isn't about mechanically meeting his needs, doing the minimum possible so as to get on to other tasks. It's about establishing a rhythm that includes some of the things distinctly not valued outside the home, like a good dose, every few hours, of inefficiency.
Now, maybe I'm the only person this ever happened to, and it wouldn't be the first time, since I sometimes think I walk in a haze of complications that don't exist for others*, but sometimes the baby would frantically latch on, nurse like a fiend for however long on that breast, and then fall deeply asleep after about 20 minutes, when he should have been ready to get going on the other side. I think that one factor is that I usually did have a good supply, which might not be the case with you.
If I took him off, he'd be done, period. Maybe an hour later he would be interested in the other breast, but even I can't sit in one place for two hours most of the time (well, I certainly did with #1, but after that, inefficiency has its limits, as does discomfort — and I never was any good at pumping or hand expressing).
Rosie not nursing, a rare sighting. |
The books (and my worried questioner) say that when a baby falls asleep in the middle of a feeding, rub his feet, blow on his face, etc. etc. These techniques had no effect. That baby was asleep and that's it.
They — the experts — have nothing else to say. They're just all like “nurse 20 minutes per side and apply cool washcloth to wake baby up.” And I think this happens a lot, actually — that the books leave you wondering, what now?
If left on the breast, he'd continue sucking. If taken off to switch, his little jaw would clamp shut and it was as if Morpheus had kidnapped him for good. Nothing, and I mean nothing, would stir him. (The irony, right? If I had wanted him to stay asleep, he'd be crying…)
Of course, he'd then wake up in an hour needing to be fed.
Meanwhile, I was working on two things for this little one:
First, getting him to have a good rhythm for nursing. I'm not talking here about the first week or so, when anything goes as far as I'm concerned, but later on, when it's good to see the pieces fall into place and to know that you have order in your day — order, to be sure, established by an infant, but order nonetheless. Maybe that doesn't make sense to you, but it does to me. It's not the imposition of a schedule but the discernment and yes, encouragement of a pattern.
Second, keeping things balanced in my body, since I was prone to breast infections and wanted to minimize engorgement. I did nurse a couple of babies sort of thoughtlessly doing one breast at a time, but came to feel that there must be a better way.
So I started thinking.
The baby gets most of the milk from the breast (although not that hind milk, true) within the first five minutes of nursing. I should have said, in my post, that I mean the first five minutes after let-down, not after latching on, necessarily, since sometimes it can take some minutes to let down. However, I think that a hungry baby isn't going to be in danger of falling asleep until he's gotten something!
Beer is a fine substitute for breastmilk, according to Papa and Joseph. |
Don't give a baby solids too soon: Deirdre. |
Everyone wants the baby…Will. |
So what I did was to switch him before that moment when he starts to change gears from all business to drifting off to la-la land.
If I waited 10 minutes, say, it was no good. He fell asleep (and remember, he'd be zonked at that point) having gotten no benefit from that second part of the feeding, and indeed it is a grave mistake to restrict a baby that way. If that is the case, it would be better to nurse only on one side. I mean, no harm done if it happens once in a while (sometimes you have to rescue the toddler from drowning or pull out a burning roast — life happens). But it's not something you want to make a habit of.
Don't think you are doing something wrong if you let the baby fall asleep at the breast! Quite the opposite. They need the end of the feeding.
Anyway, there'd be a yell of frustration at being interrupted (I'd have to have that second breast ready and waiting, no fumbling with snaps and closures allowed), and we all hate that, but he'd latch on satisfactorily for the second round and everything would proceed as usual. Getting all the fore-milk of breast #2 and sucking in his sleep to get the important hind milk.
So it seems to me that the question of hind milk is moot. In the case of nursing only on one side, there's hind milk from that one side. My way, there's hind milk from the one side, the second side. It's a wash.
I'm not saying give only that first five minutes or that it is undesirable for the baby to fall asleep while nursing. I'm saying that you can increase your supply, even it out, and get in both sides while still offering the benefit of getting that hind milk if you switch earlier than the 20 minutes usually recommended. In the case of a little stinker who falls asleep too soon and won't wake up!
If your supply is low, or you can wake the baby up, it's likely that you will not have these issues. You probably can do just what the books say and go the 20 minutes on one side and be fine on the other.
So do that! It's obviously better!
Use your common sense!
Camping — Nick with Bridget. |
It's a tip that is for those babies who are committed sleepers (when they want to be). Maybe I just have intense kids (and why would they be that way? Hmm??).
As they grow, the goal is to get a good feeding, including hind milk, out of both breasts, and it did work that way for my babies — when they were older and more alert, they did a good job at nursing on both sides completely.
{I'm not sure, but I also sort of think that they get the idea of only nursing on one breast and it becomes a habit. Later, when they need much more milk, it leads to having to nurse quite an old baby quite often, one side at a feeding, which is draining. When they nurse on both sides from the get-go, I think it might be easier to keep up with demand without spending all day, literally, nursing.}
I think we can all agree that two doses are better than one, but that takes time in some cases, and I think that a net overall increase in milk consumed, with the second side for the hind milk, is better than just nursing on one side.
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*For instance, I also had a baby who couldn't be allowed to fall completely asleep on the breast. He was what the doctor called, on the very first day, using a medical term, “a barfy baby” — a baby with a highly developed gag reflex. If he nursed until the breast was completely empty, the nipple elongated, and his throat relaxed, he'd gag and throw up the whole feeding! Talk about not getting the benefits of the hind milk! So I had to find the very last safe moment and detach him, poor thing.
Michelle says
Great post, love the family photos especially Nick with Papa, beautiful.
We are finally finding our own rhythm….#4 has been the easiest so far, go figure. Now if I could only put her down to sleep and keep her asleep. My oldest was the only one who knew what a crib was. When ever you are ready for that tutorial we will be waiting…probably with babe in arms, lol.
Betsy M says
What beautiful photos! Thanks for these posts on breastfeeding. I will be going back to review this one again as I am getting ready for #4 and although I nursed the first three for long periods of time, the beginings have always been a bit rough. I have such difficulty getting them to nurse fully (often they fall asleep of course) and then getting them to stay asleep while I set them down. Of course, as you mentioned, the books say not to let your baby fall asleep nursing. Ya sure. That just does not happen here.
Concerning the whole “side switching” debate, I ran into something odd with my second baby. My little girl had green diahrea that would not clear up and she was constantly hungry. We finally figured out that I was producing lots of fore-milk and very little hind milk (the fore-milk's lactose was making her sick). So with her I could not switch sides during my nursing. I know that this varies for each person as well as each pregnancy because it was fine with my first and third baby. Just something to keep in mind as the doc was not too helpful (of course suggesting to just bottle feed) but a lactation consultant got it right on.
_Leila says
Thanks, Betsy. Stephanie did mention the green diarrhea issue. It seemed to be something that occurs more when the mother times the feeding and doesn't let the breast empty completely, but I can see that in some cases it would make sense not to give two doses of lactose-rich milk.
And maybe your comment will help other mothers who are told their baby is allergic to their milk.
Emily says
Heehee, we have a “beer photo” in our album, too. 🙂
I had an intense baby for my first, and he'd do the same nurse/sleep thing. I ended up doing exactly what you're suggesting, and it DOES work really well. As long as I switched which side he started nursing on each time, things evened out reasonably well. (Although I did always have better supply on one side – all three times! Have no idea why that was so.)
Mom in MO says
It's great to hear this. This is how I fed my children and I know I had some funny looks and whispers behind my back about how I nursed and how long I nursed, but I just chose not to react to other people. The way I nursed just felt right and my children were well-fed, happy babies. And you are very right when you say it's about “establishing a rhythm that includes some of the things distinctly not valued outside the home, like a good dose, every few hours, of inefficiency.” My house waited to get clean, but my children grew and grew and grew.
Thanks again for a great post.
Kate says
My first child was the textbook nurser – 20 minutes each side and he'd work up a sweat doing it . My next child fell asleep after nursing briefly on one side and nothing would wake her. But she nursed more often. The difference worried me at first, since it was not “normal”. However, since she was just as healthy as her older brother (but not as backbreakingly fat) I stopped worrying. I was a much more relaxed, breastfeeding pro with the following five children. None of them were textbook anything after the first one.
Kate says
My sister's babies were all very fat babies while she was nursing – Michelin Man rolls. Her doctor said her breastmilk probably had a high fat content. I'd never heard this explanation before. My sister's kids all slimmed down once they started walking and they haven't had any weight problems as they advance into the teenage years. So if breastmilk differs, perhaps every baby's breastfeeding needs are filled differently?
freckledhen says
I love the family photos! I also love all this breastfeeding advice, every bit of information is useful. We all have such different experiences, early on I often felt I was the only one having trouble. Breastfeeding education should be a part of every pregnancy. Not just a question…breast or bottle? You are doing your part, Leila. I hope many young mothers stumble upon your blog–it will change their lives!
PS You have beautiful babies, and that picture of you in your mother's arms is so very sweet!
natashamlawler says
I love the picture of you with your Mom. It really looks like you are telling her something serious and important. And of course I love the one with Nick and Papa–it's really angelic.
emily b says
these pictures are beautiful. and the nursing advice is really helpful. i've nursed all four of my babies–and really had no idea what i was doing when i got started. i wish i had had this blog at that time. thanks for offering the wisdom here. emily b.
Citysister says
I love the family photos! There is nothing more womanly than being the sole person able to nurse your baby. I miss those tender 2am moments where my babies and I would just gaze at each other. My husband still comments on our daughter who used to pound out each last drop (she still enjoys eating every bit to this day.)
Deirdre says
Ahahahaha I laughed so hard at that photo with everyone lounging in the den. So classic! I'm not so sure about Grandpa having a pillow there… I mean, maybe. But it also looks like he could be resting on Caesar's rear. Too too funny!
That and the one with Pop holding Will between his knees! hahaha! And of course Rosie has ice cream…
Bethany says
I love the family photos!
I have to “third” the comments made earlier about green, frothy baby poop and a baby who should only nurse on one side. My first child nursed just as expected–20 minutes on each side, not too many problems falling asleep except right at first. But my second daughter, who is still only 3 months old, will get that green, frothy poop if I try to nurse her on both sides. Also, she spits up SO much if I urge her to nurse both sides. She is a VERY determined nurser and will empty one breast in 5-10 minutes. That's all she wants. And she'll nurse every 2-3 hours. (And she's big and chubby.) In one book, I read that determined, focused nursing babies who empty a breast in a short period of time often don't need to nurse both sides. And my experience so far has supported that. I guess that's the thing with breastfeeding–every baby is different, every mom is different, and as a mom you have to be willing to find what is best for your child, even if it goes against what the experts say is normal.
Oh, and by the way, I think that the only real breastfeeding experts are thoughtful women who have breastfed more than one baby for extended periods of time. So I'm loving your posts on breastfeeding!
Catherine R. says
I just wanted to say I really like the picture of you nursing… not necessarily the nursing part LOL, just the photo composition. Every square inch is filled with people. People who love eachother and are related. Just living life together and sitting so close. So different from what one would find in the “ideal” living room of today; much more space, many more possessions of much greater monetary value and far fewer people.
Ana says
Ditto to all the adorable baby photos. I have been debating if I should add another tip as it might seem a bit forward of me, but I think I will because it came in so useful for me and I never heard it mentioned during any of my lactation consultations. Passed on from an aunt/nurse.
On leaky boobs: Firm pressure on the breast (sorta like stemming the flow of blood from a wound) over the nipple at the let-down will (most of the time) stop the flow. I use a few fingers or the base of my palm. For fuller breasts, hold the pressure longer, and, for very full breasts, know that it may not work for very long, and that it is better than your breast exploding anyway.
I hope this is as hopeful for others as it was for me. I always hated it when the baby's nursing would trigger a let-down and subsequent leaking in the other breast. And, keeping those boobs dry help prevent infections too!
Lindy says
I never had to switch sides much. I had a very high supply and baby got tons (was at top of the growth charts and would often spit up from drinking too much)! If she showed interest I'd switch her. You can also nuzzle the baby from their nose to their chin with your breast to see if they will relatch. I'd sometimes do this with the opposite side just to make sure she got enough. She was nursing further apart fairly quickly (actually ended up making my cycle return at 3mo PP- thank goodness for charting!).
I also would like to say, in this and your other posts you keep mentioning having to sit down to nurse or not go shopping. I used a carrier and did babywearing from the start. I helped immensely!!! I have tons of different carriers (try various types) and found my baby liked any and all. I could also nurse in them, freeing my hands! I love it! Additionally, much more so than obnoxious nursing covers, I could discretely walk around with her latched and no one was the wiser. I've had multiple ppl come up to me and either not notice at all or only notice when they were inches from her nursing face lol! While it's unwise to do any potentially dangerous activity like using sharp knifes or cooking (all those hot surfaces) as well as squat rather than bend over, one can do a lot while babywearing (vacuum, light meal prep, shopping, walking, general tidying up, eat with both hands- almost all my carriers have salsa stains from eating out lol, etc.). It also makes a convenient place for baby to nap and no need to lug around a big stroller/carseat “travel system”. Well I don't do it constantly like some hardcore advocates, I must say it's made life so much easier. http://www.thebabywearer.com/
_Leila says
Lindy, I talk about switching sides for those moms, like me, who can get engorged on one side but baby won't be woken up for any reason after nursing on side 1!
Also, I don't mention sitting down and staying home from shopping etc as a negative. On the contrary — I believe that the necessity for slowing down that nursing imposes is part of the plan! If women experience a return of fertility earlier than they would like, they should consider one possibility being that they are not slowing down enough.
Your body needs to be convinced on many levels that it is already taking care of an infant! I realize that for some women, fertility returns and that is that. However, slowing down and refraining from too much unnecessary running around can help.